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Re: trademark policy draft



On Mon, 06 Aug 2012 10:46:34 +0100 Philip Hands wrote:

> Francesco Poli <invernomuto@paranoici.org> writes:
> 
> ...
> > [...]
> >> \item You cannot alter the DEBIAN trademarks in any way.
> > [...]
> >> \item Any scaling must retain the original proportions of the logo.
> >>
> >> \item Logo should only use ``official'' logo colors.
> > [...]
> >
> > These restrictions are currently violated by countless uses of Debian
> > logos (above all) and of the Debian textual trademark (sometimes).
> > Several such uses are done by the Debian Project itself, most notably
> > in desktop themes shipped as official Debian themes (for instance the
> > very nice default wheezy theme, named Joy [2]).
> >
> > [2] http://wiki.debian.org/DebianArt/Themes/Joy
> >
> > I think that these restrictions should be dropped entirely, since they
> > seem to be incompatible with the basic Free Software principles.
> 
> There are some things that one needs to do simply to maintain a
> trademark.  I'm pretty sure that the bits you are objecting to are
> included in that set (although IANAL).
[...]
> 
> Note that I'm not arguing that we _should_ have a trademark

I don't know, maybe the Debian Project should not hold trademarks
(through SPI or otherwise)...

The fact is, are we sure that the "price" to pay for holding a
trademark is forbidding things like the following wallpapers, for
instance?

http://debian-art.org/content/show.php/Debian+Wood?content=152000&PHPSESSID=06778f75eae318b9f3f0827945cca0f6
http://debian-art.org/content/show.php/Debian+Marble?content=151968&PHPSESSID=06778f75eae318b9f3f0827945cca0f6
http://www.superbwallpapers.com/computers/debian-7234/
http://www.superbwallpapers.com/computers/debian-7255/
http://www.superbwallpapers.com/computers/debian-7271/
http://www.wallpaperlinux.com/v/Debian/Art+Debian+Wallpaper+The+New+Debian+Linux+Pics.jpg.html?
http://www.wallpaperlinux.com/v/Debian/Cool+Debian+Dark+Wallpaper+Debian+Black+Wallpapers.jpg.html?
http://www.wallpaperlinux.com/v/Debian/Debian+1024X768+Wallpaper+Desktop+Simple+and+Cool+Debian+Logo.jpg.html?
http://www.wallpaperlinux.com/v/Debian/Debian+Abstract+Wallpaper+Linux+I+Love+My+Debian.jpg.html?
http://www.wallpaperlinux.com/v/Debian/Debian+Ball+Wallpaper+Linux+Debian+Try+The+New+Debian+Desktop.jpg.html?
http://www.wallpaperlinux.com/v/Debian/Debian+Cloud+Linux+Wallpaper+Blue+Sky+on+Debian+Desktop.jpg.html?
http://www.wallpaperlinux.com/v/Debian/Debian+For+Desktop+Wallpaper+Debian+Project+Pictures.jpg.html?
http://www.wallpaperlinux.com/v/Debian/Debian+Image+Wallpaper+Debian+Picture+Wallpaper+2008.jpg.html?
http://www.wallpaperlinux.com/v/Debian/Debian+Linux+Gnu+Wallpapers+Desktop+Debian+Alternatives.jpg.html?
http://www.wallpaperlinux.com/v/Debian/Debian+Picture+Wallpaper+Desktop+Wallpapers.jpg.html?
http://www.wallpaperlinux.com/v/Debian/Debian+Plastik+Wallpaper+Linux+Debian+Desktop.jpg.html?

and so forth, and so forth, and so forth, ...

And if this is really the price to pay, isn't too high a price?

> -- I'm with
> Lars in that I think it's somewhat distasteful for Debian to be dirtying
> our hands with this, but if that's the only way we can stop some bastard
> From distributing "Official Debian CDs" that turn out to be packed with
> back-doors and trojans, then we need to do the legal bits properly, and
> that involves following the legal advice we receive, rather than
> spouting unfounded drivel about what we might like the law to be.

I am not a lawyer, and I have very little knowledge of trademark laws
(I am a debian-legal regular, but we talk about copyrights much more
often than about trademarks there...).
It is not my intention to spout drivel, but I really hope that an
acceptable solution exists *within the law* and *within Free Software
principles* at the same time. Otherwise the Project should go a totally
different way (maybe abandoning its trademarks, as said above, I don't
know...).

[...]
> 
> That said, those granted the right to play with the trademark can
> presumably do so.  We just need to grant that permission in the cases
> you seem concerned about.

Grant special permissions to *all* those people wanting to create a
wallpaper referring to Debian?!? And to *all* those people wanting to
do other creative things with Debian trademarks/logos?!?

I think that the only feasible way to do that is granting those
permissions *inside* the trademark policy itself, which is not too
different from dropping the restrictions I quoted, as I was
suggesting...


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