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Re: Bug#42477: PROPOSED} delay the /usr/doc transition till after potato



On 15 Aug 1999, Manoj Srivastava wrote:

> >>"Santiago" == Santiago Vila <sanvila@unex.es> writes:
> 
>  Santiago> This has not happened in this case.  We decided to switch
>  Santiago> from FSSTND to FHS, which includes switching from /usr/doc
>  Santiago> to /usr/share/doc, and nobody objected, so we had a
>  Santiago> consensus.
> 
>         We made a general, sweeping, policy decision, to adopt the
>  FHS. The detail, it was expected, would be worked out. We also said
>  that not all details of the FHS may be adopted (/var/state is one
>  that comes to mind).
> 
>         We are now working the details out.

Well, you say that we made a "general" policy decision to adopt the FHS,
but the fact is that policy was patched to read /usr/share/doc everywhere
instead of /usr/doc. This does not seem like a little "detail" to me.

>  Santiago> This issue is already resolved by current policy, which
>  Santiago> says to use /usr/share/doc, with no special symlinks or
>  Santiago> anything.
> 
>         No. The policy says no such thing. Show me, the paragraph,
>  where it says that. 

About /usr/share/doc: There are lots of paragraphs talking about
/usr/share/doc, I don't think we need to quote them.

About symlinks: see below.

>         Not mentioning symlinks in no way prohibits them 

You may be mixing different things here.

I thought we were discussing about this proposal (the one in bug #42477,
i.e. /usr/doc vs /usr/share/doc).

You seem to be talking about "/usr/share/doc with symlinks" vs
"/usr/share/doc without symlinks".

>  Santiago> I don't have any special "model of doing things". I just
>  Santiago> think that we reached a consensus when we decided to switch
>  Santiago> from /usr/doc to /usr/share/doc.
> 
>         We are not rescinding that.

I think we are.

>  Santiago> Now some people want to break the consensus and go back to
>  Santiago> /usr/doc, and I consider this as a bad thing, because it
>  Santiago> breaks a previous consensus. That's all.
> 
>         I think you are mistaken. The people merely want to defer the
>  timetable for that particular move. The original decision to adopt
>  the FHS did not do anymore than set a tentative timetable, and the
>  timing details can be defined by subsequent proposals, like this
>  one.

I thought that policy was policy, not "tentative" policy.

The way I read your words it almost seems that someone has to present a
proposal and get seconds to keep things as they are (i.e. use
/usr/share/doc without requiring symlinks).

>  Santiago> If you think current policy procedures are unacceptable,
>  Santiago> please amend them. I don't think it is necessary.
> 
>         I think we do need to specify some additional guidelines for
>  using the veto. Overfrequent (note: I did not say frivoulous) use of
>  the veto shall shackle this group, since that would require near
>  unanimity, rather than the 75% super majority we agreed to when we
>  adopted the guidelines.

If we go back to /usr/doc, I will be tempted to use the word "frivolous" 
for the previous policy amendment that switched from /usr/doc to
/usr/share/doc some weeks ago. I think policy matters should be treated
more seriously than that, and going back to /usr/doc would be a bad
precedent.

>  >> I think that the current attitude of intellectual intolerance
>  >> (I *must be right, and everyone else is obvioulsy wrong) would make
>  >> the policy list ineffective.
> 
>  Santiago> The policy list is still effective for dealing with
>  Santiago> technical issues, and I hope it will continue to be.
> 
>        I think we can be more than that. I think that we should be
>  able to pass amendments that may even be unpalatable to some people.

For example, the symlink forrest on a per package basis? ;-)

>         Requiring us to please all the people on the list all the time
>  would make it impossible to achieve anything in here.

I wish you were a little bit more optimistic.

I think the procedure for amending policy (proposed by you, btw :-) has
worked very well so far, and I'm very glad of that.

"impossible to achieve anything"? The reality I see is very different.

Thanks.

-- 
 "75ec58b08ad1131a4cb235931704baa5" (a truly random sig)


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