Re: changelog practice, unfinalised vs UNRELEASED vs ~version
On Thu, 2017-02-23 at 17:57:33 +0000, Ian Jackson wrote:
> Simon McVittie writes ("Re: changelog practice, unfinalised vs UNRELEASED vs ~version"):
> > On Thu, 23 Feb 2017 at 12:53:40 +0000, Ian Jackson wrote:
> > > We could decorate the suite instead, but that does not have any
> > > effect on generated binaries.
> > It does have an effect on the changelog inside the source and binary
> > packages,
> True. But I still think it would be a good idea for unreleased
> binaries to show up as such in the dpkg database.
I can agree with that.
> > and on the changes file (which is precisely the signed
> > instruction to the archive,
> (Of course such things should not end up signed, but, this point is
> How about the following, which provides more flexibility for what
> individual users want:
> * Unfinalised changeslogs should contain UNRELEASED in either
> the suite name or the version number. (Currently there is
> no consensus about this.)
Please, not the version number. Globally overloading the version to
convey this kind of information would be unfortunate IMO. This, not
only affects us but derivatives too, and depending on whether the
package is native or not, and depending ono where the marking is
placed (upstream or revision part) it also affects the versioning
of upstream projects.
I was very happy when proposing the binary-only=yes keyword and it
being accepted, so that I will be able to eventually remove the
hardcoded parsing of +bN from dpkg-dev. Unfortunately we still have
hardcoded parsing for ~bpo and ~vola to use magic behavior based on
that. I should propose a new backport=yes or similar to deprecate
> * Where the suite contains UNRELEASED, it SHOULD NOT be simply
> `UNRELEASED'. It should be `unstable-UNRELEASED' or
> `experimental-UNRELEASED' or such.
The suite should be "invalid" to avoid accidental or unwanted uploads
by third parties in case one needs to sign an intermediate build.
I think using a magic value in the suite name is better. We then could
source (1.0) UNRELEASED; urgency=medium, suite=unstable
source (1.0) UNRELEASED; urgency=medium, unreleased-for=unstable
source (1.0) unstable-UNRELEASED; urgency=medium
The advantage of the ones using the metadata key/values is that those
can very easily end up in the generated binaries as fields. So in that
case something like the "Unreleased-For: unstable" would be a pretty
> * Tools which generates .changes files (specifically,
> dpkg-genchanges) should, if they find that the version contains
> UNRELEASED and the suite does not, append UNRELEASED to the suite.
> (This is to help save downstreams etc.)
> * The Debian archive will be taught to reject anything with a version
> containing UNRELEASED (as I proposed before).
For these two points, see above. Also this implies having to hunt down
any archive software and fix it, even local scripts etc. It seems too
unsafe to me. :/
> > As I noted on #542747, this property of changes files also means that if
> > a Debian derivative (or an addon repository like apt.postgresql.org) has
> > DD contributors, then that derivative should avoid using a Debian suite
> > name as its suite name. This is because anyone obtaining a DD-signed
> > .changes file for that addon repository could upload it to the main
> > Debian repository, and it would normally be accepted into the suite
> > of the same name. apt.postgresql.org seems to be one of the few addon
> > repositories that does this (IMO) correctly, by using a distinct suite
> > name (in their case jessie-pgdg).
Right, that's why for exampel we initially chose "unreleased" as suite
name for the Debian ports archive when they were hosted at gnuab.org!
> > I can't help wondering whether changes files ought to include some
> > globally unique indication of the project in which the change is
> > requested
> Yes, they should.
We are currently somewhat lacking both, where the changes were built
in, and what they were targetting.
I've had a draft [O] for this for years (as a result of an initial
proposal for more generalized bug closure support [C]), which was the
base for the dpkg-vendor, but it seems I never ended up discussing it
more widely within the project for full support. :/ At least from the
initial discussion years ago of [C] in [T], there didn't seem to be
much consensus or wide interest.
We are now already recording the Origin where the build was done in the
.buildinfo file in the Build-Origin field. IMO the binaries should all
gain an Origin field too, automatically injected at build time.
And the target distribution is now somewhat encoded in the changelog
suite, but that has the problem that many derivatives seem to just use
"unstable" instead of naming their own suite, so it's not a very good
discriminator. Annotating the origin in the changelog would be the way
to go IMO, as noted in the [O].
> > (for instance debian.org, ubuntu.com or [apt.]postgresql.org);
> > but at the moment they don't, and I don't see an obvious place in the
> > workflow to declare "this is really for Debian" vs. "this is for
> > apt.postgresql.org". Maybe at debsign time?
> (`dgit push' already (thinks it) knows the answer to this question and
> could insert the right information.)
> I don't think debsign is the right place.
> If the suite name is not globally unique, then the full qualification
> should be in the changelog. Ie, the changelog should contain the
> intended target archive.
Yeah, also because the changes in general target a specific origin/suite,
but please check [O]. (Although I perhaps should start a new thread
with just the proposal itself.)