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Re: [RFC] Changing APT to pre-depend on ${shlibs:Depends}

On Thu, Apr 28, 2011 at 06:48:22PM +0200, Julian Andres Klode wrote:
> > "We might some day later change the way apt works for upgrades" is not an
> > argument for adding a pre-dependency now.

> But that we do want to prevent a broken APT -- when using the common
> "dpkg -i ...; apt-get install -f" idiom (where ... is APT) -- certainly
> is an argument. 

Yeah.  I don't strongly disagree with this argument, but I also don't find
it particularly persuasive.  apt already treats apt as special, I don't
think it's very consistent to ask dpkg and other front ends to also treat
apt specially (by way of Pre-Depends).

> The counter argument seems to be 
>         - we do not protect the user from removing APT with dpkg
>                 => counter argument: dpkg -i is common, dpkg -R is not
>                 (see Raphaël's email)
>         - there are other package managers
>                 => counter argument: No other package manager has as few
>                 dependencies as APT and as high priority.

	- it doesn't fit with the usual justifications of Pre-Depends
	  (needed in preinst, or package is essential and must be usable
	  when unpacked), and it will be pointed to as precedent for other
	  non-traditional uses of Pre-Depends, when it's already hard to
	  explain to people when Pre-Depends should be used and why?

(Yes, I know that I've just been responsible for a much worse instance of
this in the case of multiarch-support; I'm not thrilled about that either,
but don't see any other way to ensure reliable upgrades to wheezy.)

> So practically spoken, we are at something like +0.5 for the change
> based on the arguments. Based on votes, we're currently at +1.

> -1 jackyf@debian.org
> +1 peter@p12n.org
> +1 hertzog@debian.org
> -2 kalnischkies+debian@gmail.com
> +2 jak@debian.org
>  0 mvo@debian.org
> ------------------
> +1 total (maximum 9)

Well, I guess you could count me as a weak -1 here.

Steve Langasek                   Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer                   to set it on, and I can move the world.
Ubuntu Developer                                    http://www.debian.org/
slangasek@ubuntu.com                                     vorlon@debian.org

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