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Re: "How to recognise different ETCH wishlists from quite a long way away" (revised)

On Fri, Jul 08, 2005 at 07:07:20PM +0200, Marco d'Itri wrote:
> On Jul 08, Wouter Verhelst <wouter@debian.org> wrote:
> > > > Feel free to add any other wishlists (or discuss any one of them). I'll try 
> > > > to track the subsequent thread and keep the list current somewhere...
> > > Make hotplug depend on udev (this simplifies a lot the hotplug scripts).
> > No you don't.
> If you really feel strongly about this then you will have to provide
> some arguments too, considering the higly positive side effects that
> such a change would have (and that at some point in the future udev will
> be mandatory anyway).

This was said about DevFS too, when it was introduced.

My gripe with udev is that, last I tried, it
* was far too fragile, with races all over the place which make some
  things work correctly some of the time and not at all on the next
* requires way too much configuration for a system which only exists to
  access my hardware, with documentation in /usr/share/doc/udev which
  blatantly states that some things *will not* work out of the box, and
  *will* require you to manually configure stuff.

In contrast, static /dev stuff Just Works. It might not have the same
features as udev does; but what it does, it does well, with next to *no*
configuration and *no* races.

Of course, if the situation has been improved since, so much the better;
but 'last I tried' was only two months ago, IIRC.

In that light, I urge you not to make udev usage mandatory for hotplug
in the near future. If the problems with udev are fixed (in that the
races are gone and stuff will just work out of the box), then perhaps.
Not just yet.

The amount of time between slipping on the peel and landing on the
pavement is precisely one bananosecond

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