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Re: testing and no release schedule

On Sun, Mar 28, 2004 at 06:40:02PM -0600, Steve Greenland wrote:
> On 26-Mar-04, 17:44 (CST), Adam McKenna <adam@flounder.net> wrote: 
> > There are penalties in Debian for not fulfilling one's responsibilities, just
> > like at any real job.  Yes, we can play semantic games and say 'nobody can
> > force you to do anything', but if you don't do your work at Debian you will
> > be marginalized in favor of those who do.
> Sure. But the thing is, I only signed up to maintain a few packages. 

Then do that.  But do it with the right mindset.  Debian is about releasing a
high quality operating system, not just keeping unstable up to date.

> > > Several maintainers are on the record as not caring about releases at
> > > all - unstable meets their needs.
> > 
> > But our priority is not the developers' needs.  Our priorities are our users
> > and free software.  Our users need frequent stable releases.
> Depends on the user. People with a room full of servers don't, in fact,
> want frequent stable releases.

I have a question..  Do you actually have a room full of servers?  And I'm
not talking about your bedroom or the Computer Science lab at school.  I mean
a room full of servers that an actual business depends on.  I'm not asking
this question to be derisive, I just want to know where you're coming from.

I have a room full of mission critical servers.  Several rooms, in fact, and
I don't feel how you're claiming I feel.

> security fixes coming for a couple of years on any given release.

That is for the security team to decide.  I think we can find a happy medium
between a six month release cycle and a 3 year release cycle.

> > Developers who state openly that they do not care about releases are
> > in violation of the Social Contract.
> Oh, crap. There are *lots* of different kinds of users. If nothing else,
> every Debian Developer is a user. So if a certain subset of them are
> happy with unstable, what's the big deal? If all I had to deal with was
> my home desktop, I'd be happy with unstable, too.

Nothing's wrong with them being happy with unstable.  I'm happy with
unstable.  But there is a difference between being happy with unstable and
publically stating that you do not care about releases.

There's actually a word for a software product that never releases..  It's
called 'vaporware'.  I trust you've heard this term before?

If debian turns into a product that only serves the needs of its Developers,
and not its users, people will use something else and Debian will become
irrelevant.  I know some people will say they don't care if that happens.
Well, those people are only thinking about their own needs and are not
honoring the spirit of the Social Contract.


Adam McKenna  <adam@debian.org>  <adam@flounder.net>

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