Re: Consequences of udev being pulled in by Gnome

[Sven Luther <sven.luther@wanadoo.fr>]

On Tue, Feb 22, 2005 at 12:40:21PM +0100, Frans Pop wrote:
> Triggered by some installation reports where I noticed udev being 
> mentioned, there was the following discussion on #d-boot:
> 
> <fjp> I sometimes see udev mentioned in installation reports. How would a 
> user get udev with d-i? It isn't installed by default, is it?
> <h01ger> desktop-task, gnome pulls in udev - afaik
> <fjp> Ah, right.
> * fjp practically never installs the desktop task...
> <Kamion> that's crack, that means that udev is being installed after the 
> first reboot so you have to put up with the static /dev -> udev 
> transition
> <Kamion> although I guess that means we force the static /dev -> udev 
> transition to work :P
> <Kamion> but it means you really need another reboot to get the system 
> into a vaguely sane state
> <fjp> Kamion: Yes, the installation report was complaining about that. RC 
> bug against gnome? ;-)
> <Kamion> dunno; there's an argument that says we should always install 
> udev for 2.6 installs, but it's too late to make that change
> <Kamion> (would require a lot of testing)
> * h01ger can confirm: i also saw this (unable to login via ssh & local via 
> console) after installing desktop-task last weekend - a reboot "fixed 
> it". as tfm says...
> <h01ger> errata ?
> <fjp> h01ger: That would be a bit thin for Sarge release. Who reads the 
> errata before installing officially released CDs? Release notes or 
> installation manual: maybe a few more people, but same thing.
> 
> So, are we happy that installation of the desktop task is going to force a 
> 'static /dev -> udev transition' (as Colin so beautifully calls it) on 
> users?
> 
> There appear to be several consequences from installing udev in 2nd stage:
> - system needs to be rebooted one more time;
> - from Holgers comment: system may not be fully usable until the reboot;
> - as I understand it from reading some threads on the lists, support
>   for some devices which work fine _without_ udev may need manual
>   configuration of udev before they will work _with_ udev.
> 
> Can/should anything be done about this?
> If it's left in, how can we best document it?

Just added this to the bug report(s).

I had an idea though, what if :

  1) udev gets an additional debconf note/questions/whatever.

  2) it checks if we come straigth from d-i (or are upgrading from woody, or
  in any other way require a reboot).

  3) Inform the user that a reboot is needed in order for it to work.
  
I guess udev may already do some of the above, i remember a note about this,
but we have to make sure it is shown in the debian-installer path.

Friendly,

Sven Luther