Bug#90204: installation process unclear when network card not found
Whit <whit@transpect.com> writes:
> On Wed, Mar 21, 2001 at 09:20:21PM -0500, Adam Di Carlo wrote:
> > This is described in detail in the install manual:
> > <URL:http://www.debian.org/releases/stable/i386/ch-init-config.en.html#s-configure-network>
> >
> > I'll need more specific information about what in that section needs
> > to be improved. Please include literal text you would like to see
> > included.
> What the section you reference does not do is provide any follow-up
> procedure in case the automatic installation routine fails to detect an
> installed card when one is there.
Sure it does. I quote:
| If the installation system does detect a network device, you'll be
| presented with the ``Configure the Network'' step. If the system does
| not allow you to run this step, then that means it cannot see any
| network devices present. If you have a network device, that means you
| probably missed configuring the device back in the ``Configure Device
| Driver Modules'', Section 7.13 step; go back there and look for net
| devices.
> Since there will be situations in which
> someone is installing Debian on a system which has a card which can be
> supported by a Linux kernel, but not by the kernel in the distro,
Sure, but at that point, they're in an unsupported zone. Its actually
very rare (in fact, I've never heard of any cases) where NIC devices
aren't supported by one of the stock kernels. Anyhow, they can read
about replacing the kernel in that section.
> the user will (1) have not help from the install routine at setting
> up networking, then (2) update their kernel to support their
> hardware but (3) still have no guidance from the installation
> document on the efficient way at that point to complete the
> networking setup, initially bypassed because it couldn't find the
> card.
I disagree. You're talking about unsupported hardware. We don't
support it. They can read the section about replacing the kernel and
try that if they are ambitious.
> In my case I finally realized that the 3c59x driver would support the 3c905
> card (3c59x hasn't in the past supported all 3c905's ... and probably won't
> in the future - there will always be cases where the user has to fetch a
> driver from somewhere), and ran through the install routine a second time to
> get the networking part set.
>
> I still don't know what the best stand-alone way to configure networking on
> a Debian system is. The text I'd suggest would be a mention of whatever that
> method is, so that people for whom the current automated installation fails
> because of lack of immediate kernel support for their hardware can still
> straightforwardly complete the install, once the kernel support for their
> card is in place. I'd write it if I knew what the method was. I'd also
> mention how to re-enter any other parts setup procedure which would have
> been bypassed when the network card wasn't seen the first time around.
The final paragraph reads:
| If you can't find any of these answers, use the system's guesses --
| you can change them once the system has been installed, if necessary,
| by editing /etc/network/interfaces.
Again, I'm failing to understand what you think should be in there but
is not. Diffs would be appreciated I guess.
Remember that the purpose of the installation manual to document all
the ways that Debian works, and all the little kernel tweaks and
things. This is for the Debian FAQ, the Linux HOWTOs, and such.
> > > Why not have an option to go ahead and set up the networking options on the
> > > first pass _even if the network card isn't recognized yet_?
> >
> > That's the way it works, and that won't be changing. There's no
> > reasonable networking you can do without a device anyhow.
>
> Again, if you have the NIC, but need to compile a fresh kernel or
> module to get it active after the first stage of the Debian install,
> it would be good to have a clear roadmap to a second stage which
> would complete the install. You are probably well-aware of the
> required steps if you are maintaining the current install routine. I
> still don't know what they are. If you'd outline them for me, I'd be
> happy to test them and polish the prose - I've done years of work in
> magazine editing.
Already quoted above. Edit /etc/network/interfaces.
On a fully installed system, you can re-read that configuration with
'ifdown -a' then 'ifup -a'. Again, I'm kinda hesitant to put this
kind of networking documentation in this manual. We have to maintain
the documentation in perpetuity, and I'd like to keep the scope
restricted to the install procedure.
--
.....Adam Di Carlo....adam@onshore.com.....<URL:http://www.onshored.com/>
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