Re: [Debconf-discuss] Zagreb <--> Banja Luka
On Thu, May 05, 2011 at 10:09:07PM +0100, Philip Hands wrote:
> On Thu, 5 May 2011 17:08:48 +0200, Josip Rodin <joy@entuzijast.net> wrote:
> > On Thu, May 05, 2011 at 04:31:03PM +0200, Ana Guerrero wrote:
> > > > > - if you arrive/departure very late/early to Zagreb, what are your options?
> > > >
> > > > http://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf11/Travel-Arriving
> > >
> > > Thanks Josip! That link has a lot of the information I was requesting.
> >
> > BTW as far as that last matter is concerned, can you give an example?
>
> Ah, that's irritating timing, I read this after I spent the afternoon
> discovering most of the information that's on that wiki page via other
> means.
>
> It would be very helpful for others if that was more obviously linked on
> the "Getting there" page, or some such.
>
> Ah, I see it now is, good -- that should be more prominent though IMO,
> and should probably come before both the LAND and AIR bits -- actually,
> they are pretty useless when compared to the Travel-Arriving page, so
> should probably just go, or be incorporated into that page.
>
> The "LAND" bit, that is offered first assumes you're driving, which is
> one of the less likely options, so should perhaps go later.
Yes, I agree. I also didn't find that Michelin road map particularly nice.
Google Maps works just fine up to the final border crossing, the one between
Croatia and Bosnia, and after that it's almost a straight line of just 45 km
or so.
Worst case is they built a better road there and put up toll booths so
they'll rip you off a bit, but once you're so close to the destination,
you won't care :)
> The "AIR" seems to assume that you'll be flying into Banja Luka direct,
> which I think very few people will manage, and there is no "RAIL"
> option.
Yes. The air thing was fixed on the wiki page ages ago.
I further fixed the rail options on the wiki more recently.
> There should be a strong indication that people need to make their way
> to Zagreb (unless people have alternative suggestions that I've failed
> to notice).
I don't think that's necessarily true, because there could viable options
via other means. For example, if someone get an intercontinental flight to
Zurich and then directly to Banja Luka. Or if a combination of flights
via Ljubljana and then a bus is cheaper than a combination via Zagreb and
then a bus. Or if timing is better.
But I could be wrong. I'm just being graceful so people don't say I'm acting
as an agent for my local airport ;)
> One thing that should be highlighted is that the buses are faster than
> the trains, and run more often, for the final hundred kilometres or so.
> This should be stated repeatedly, with accompanying facts to back it up,
> because it seems pretty odd to someone from the UK at least, to the
> point that I pretty much decided that it simply must be nonsense until
> I'd found all the relevant timetables and confirmed it for myself. Yes,
> I know you told me that, and yes I'm an idiot for not simply believing
> it, but it just struck me as something I ought to confirm because it
> seemed odd that a bus should be preferred over a train for that sort of
> distance.
Yes. The thing is, the rail route to Banja Luka goes over a slower, somewhat
winding track, which probably hasn't seen an upgrade lately.
A modernized rail track that supports half-decently-fast trains runs from
Zagreb roughly in the same direction, but it doesn't go through or near
Banja Luka. The reason that one is faster is that it runs through a
flatland, roughly matching the course of the Sava river, and it also
continues on to multiple different countries so it's more economically
interesting. The closest town to Banja Luka on that route is Okucani, but
there is no rail connection between there and Banja Luka, only road.
> For instance, even the sleeper train from Munich, which would think is
> one of the fast trains that are hinted at in the notes on the tips page,
> takes longer to get from Zagreb than the bus that sets off at about the
> same time -- I think this should be emphasised on the site, since it
> just didn't fit into my head that that could really be the case until
> I'd found and then compared all the timetables -- it would be good to
> save others from wasting their time in the same way.
The rail route through the Alps isn't particularly fast. You know, what with
all the chained 2000-meter mountains that have obstructed transport in this
areas since the dawn of mankind. :))
> It would also be good to mention things like the fact that, yes there is
> a bus and train from Sarajevo, but the times are pretty unlikely to make
> you happy, so getting flights there is probably pointless. The same
> goes for Belgrade from what I can tell. Then again, I might have missed
> things, since my research was all online, and partly via bablefish.
I thought my sorting of
http://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf11/Travel-Arriving#By_air
was indicative enough :) admittedly I just did some basic screening out
(I pruned only nearby airports that had zero incoming flights :).
--
2. That which causes joy or happiness.
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