Bug#695182: [RFC] Reproducible OOM with just a few sleeps
On Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 1:22 AM, <paul.szabo@sydney.edu.au> wrote:
> Dear Sedat,
>
>> ... it really makes sense to switch to x86_64
>> (amd64) architecture when you have a modern computer.
>> Switching makes even more sense when you have more than 4GiB RAM.
>
> You seem to say that one should switch to amd64 (if hardware allows),
> even with less than 4GB RAM (where 32-bit non-PAE HIGHMEM4G kernel would
> work fine), and that one should definitely switch with over 4GB RAM.
> There would be no need or use for PAE kernels, which should be dropped.
>
> I think I agree.
>
[ OK, you took the thread from LKML to the Debian bug, anyway ]
Where I see problems is the fact that you are more or less "forced" to
switch to 64-bit.
Why?
(Read my thoughts below.)
The bigger problem I am seeing is that as most developers decided to
go the 64-bit way the 32-bit path is no more tested correctly.
When I insisted to run a 32-bit system I fell over so much UNTESTED software.
I talked with a lot of developers around the Linux kernel and Debian
world and those guys - if you ask them in private - would drop 32-bit
entirely.
To be honest - I am speaking of the x86 world and remember also darkly
issues in early MULTIAAARGH support on Debian.
( As an example: Building a gcc upstream release tarball (unpatched!)
in an multiarch environment. Look for my bug-reports if you are
interested in. )
If there exist no more 32-bit x86 veterans...
The world will turn around - approximately the same way and speed :-).
So if you want to concentrate on working, make your decisions carefully!
( Noone pays you for fixing all the time your working OS - saying that
as a longterm Debian/sid user. )
Just from my experiences.
Regards,
- Sedat -
> Thanks, Paul
>
> Paul Szabo psz@maths.usyd.edu.au http://www.maths.usyd.edu.au/u/psz/
> School of Mathematics and Statistics University of Sydney Australia
>
>
> ---
>
> Quoting in full for the benefit of 695182@bugs.debian.org :
>
>> From sedat.dilek@gmail.com Tue Jan 15 21:26:14 2013
>> Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 11:25:41 +0100
>> Subject: Re: [RFC] Reproducible OOM with just a few sleeps
>> From: Sedat Dilek <sedat.dilek@gmail.com>
>> To: paul.szabo@sydney.edu.au, Paul Szabo <psz@maths.usyd.edu.au>
>> Cc: LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>, linux-mm <linux-mm@kvack.org>,
>> Ben Hutchings <ben@decadent.org.uk>
>>
>> Hi Paul,
>>
>> I followed a bit the thread you started in [1].
>>
>> As you might know i386 got eliminated in Linux-3.8.
>>
>> I had several discussions with the Debian kernel-team about the iN86
>> (N=4..6) and PAE kernel-flavours.
>> On the one hand I can understand the reduction of linux-images
>> especially for iN86.
>> Even i486 is a bit unfirm as there is no much hardware around, but
>> Debian will keep i486 for a while (release maintenance).
>>
>> Topic PAE:
>> Unfortunately, I had a notebook with a Intel Centrino Banias CPU (no
>> PAE) which should use the -486 kernel-flavour due to the Debian
>> kernel-team.
>> I played with some different kernel-setup which did not give me more
>> benefit (openssl benchmarks etc.)
>> The -686-pae kernel did run on my hardware, but as known with all the
>> SMP-NO-OPs.
>>
>> Depending on the hardware, it really makes sense to switch to x86_64
>> (amd64) architecture when you have a modern computer.
>> Switching makes even more sense when you have more than 4GiB RAM.
>> IMHO using a -686-amd64 Debian kernel makes ZERO sense, real 64-Bit or die!
>>
>> I switched to 64-bit... and I switched from Debian/sid to
>> Ubuntu/precise as well :-).
>> ( NOTE: I am working here since April 2012 in a WUBI environment (no
>> native Ubuntu Linux) :-). )
>>
>> And I am building my kernels by myself.
>> So I know very well whom to blame :-).
>>
>> Some last words: I had several fruitful or fruitless discussions with
>> the Debian kernel-team, but I can confirm (with all my heart) this
>> team makes a fantastic job.
>> I can recommend you Ben's blog (recently I read a series about news in
>> the Debian/wheezy kernel) if your world is Debian or Ubuntu (Debian !=
>> Ubuntu).
>>
>> Just my 0.02EUR (no British pound, here as well: when you are a member
>> of the EU chose EUR not pound!).
>>
>> Regards,
>> - Sedat -
>>
>>
>> [1] http://marc.info/?t=135796172200001&r=1&w=2
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