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Re: Integrate Knoppix in Debian (was: Re: Debian Enterprise?)



On Wed, Nov 26, 2003 at 04:05:08PM +1000, Anthony Towns wrote:
> On Tue, Nov 25, 2003 at 08:39:16AM +0100, Javier Fern?ndez-Sanguino Pe?a wrote:
> > > Is there a process for making these CDs from nothing more than debs
> > > downloaded from debian.org?
> > I know at least of one such process and its the one used at metadistros 
> > (metadistros.hispalinux.es). The tool in this case is called 'calzador'. 

Looking at the question again I see that I did not answer the question 
properly. The process used by Metadistros is not based exclusively on 
Debian downloaded debs, but uses some custom tools/software. The 'calzador' 
is really just part of the process and is really a set of preconfiguration 
data/scripts for use in a LiveCD.

> 
> Is there any code that goes with that? I saw the wiki, but not knowing any
> Spanish, didn't really get much from it.

Yes, maybe not too ready for mainstream:
ftp://ftp.softwarelibre.ulpgc.es/METADISTROS/calzador/calzador.tar.bz2

the (modified) kernel modules for Live-CD support are available at
ftp://ftp.softwarelibre.ulpgc.es/METADISTROS/calzador/modulos.tar.bz2 

The procedure is not yet completely automated (I got it wrong, sorry). It 
is described (in Spanish) at 
http://metadistros.hispalinux.es/tiki-index.php?page=HowTo

> > IIRC it basicly depends on having a chroot environment set with the OS 
> > image you want to burn and it adds that together with  the bootup stuff.
> 
> > > Obviously it's non-trivial, but it should be possible to have debootstrap
> > > (or a similar tool) construct bootable Knoppix-esque CDs without any
> > > user-interaction IMO.
> 
> I'm envisaging something like:
> 
> 	mkdir sarge-chroot
> 	debootstrap --include knoppix,calzador sarge sarge-chroot
> 		# setup a chroot environment with knoppix and calzador tools
> 	chroot sarge-chroot /usr/sbin/knoppix install-pkgs
> 		# install and configure the standard "knoppix" patches

This step in meta-distros is based on a meta-package that downloads all the 
needed packages and dependancies.

(...)
> Being able to automatically install a useful system with lots of  gnome
> and kde and whatever other stuff without having to spend hours in dselect
> or aptitude or answering questions or doing other configuration stuff
> has obvious benefits, as does being able to easily convert an existing
> system into something you can burn to a CD.

That's really what has made interest in Knoppix-like distributions spark.

> Also obvious, though, is that both those steps are hard: working out
> a good set of packages to install, and configuring them usefully is
> non-trivial; as is making Debian work with a read-only root.

That's why people usually 'remaster' Knoppix instead of starting from 
scratch. That is, they take the live-CD, dump it to disk, chroot into it, 
remove/add stuff and generate a new liveCd.

> (While the hypothetical /usr/sbin/knoppix and /usr/sbin/tasksel both
> solve similar problems they're not quite the same -- /usr/sbin/knoppix
> needs to select _and_ configure all the packages you want, tasksel just
> selects them. debconf might not be enough either -- /usr/sbin/knoppix
> might need to actually modify various files in /etc, too)

Taken into account the configuration stuff in Live-CDs is usually done 
manually and is also very specific to the kind of live-CD you want to 
create (as well as who will use it, what applications you want to include, 
etc..). I don't believe that should be included in a /usr/sbin/knoppix.
I might be wrong however.

Regards

Javi

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