Steve Lamb wrote: > No. But you said that the opposite is the wrong reason. If we like > Debian it is a bad reason to want to contribute. So the it is only > logical to presume that if you feel liking is a bad reason disliking > might very well be a good one. This is "logical"? In what universe? Andrew said that merely liking Debian wasn't a good enough reason to want to join the project. His point, I think, was that you should have a desire to _do_ something in particular, whether or not you are a "Debian developer". Is your goal to be a Debian developer, and you're willing to do some work in order to be accepted into the project? Or is your goal to get some useful work done, in which case being an official developer is just a convenience? > Obviously you want people who like the project to contribute. For meaningful values of "contribute", sure. But being a project member with a d.o account is not essential to contributing, and its arguable how significant a "contribution" it is to just maintain a few packages when Debian is so big already (unless they're important packages, in which case it seems you are more likely to get through the NM process quickly). I don't deny that the sponsorship requirement for non-developers is annoying, but if worse comes to worst, you can simply set up your own repository and Bugzilla somewhere and publicize its location for the benefit of those users who want your packages. If you don't have the bandwidth or full-time connection or hosting arrangements to do such a thing, well, gee. Life is hard, isn' t it. > No, I am pointing out that it appears that Debian, on the whole, > needs an attitude readjustment. On the one hand you have d.o people > blasting people for not contributing and on the other you have d.o > people discouraging people from contributing. You cannot have it both > ways. Either you accept the contributions that come or you stop > blasting people because they don't contribute. The NM process, viewed from the outside (and I'm on the outside too), looks like quite a mess. I dislike the obvious dishonesty of the project having a documented process for new maintainers, important aspects of which are ignored by the people responsible for running it. That this is excused by various other project members is rather sad. If the Debian project and its leadership are unwilling to require (and enforce the requirement) that the DAM follow the NM procedure as written, including formally rejecting people if they're not going to be approved, then the documentation should be updated to reflect this. At least it would be honest, whatever else one might say about it, to say openly that unacceptable applicants will be ignored until they go away. Craig
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