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Re: Resolving the controversy

On Sat, Nov 22, 2008 at 14:09, Ben Finney <ben+debian@benfinney.id.au> wrote:
> "Sandro Tosi" <morph@debian.org> writes:
>> On Sat, Nov 22, 2008 at 13:41, Ben Finney <ben+debian@benfinney.id.au> wrote:
>> > "Sandro Tosi" <morph@debian.org> writes:
>> >> On Sat, Nov 22, 2008 at 10:34, Ben Finney <ben+debian@benfinney.id.au> wrote:
>> >> > Jacob Hallén <jacob@openend.se> writes:
>> >> >> Debian is not 100% free software, and it never has been.
>> >> >
>> >> > Indeed. Those instances where it's not free are bugs to be
>> >> > fixed.
>> >>
>> >> So, you actually wanna do something to fix those bugs or wanna
>> >> simply talk about them?
>> >
>> > That's a false dichotomy. The talk in this context is regarding
>> > whether they are DFSG violations at all.
>> Really? so can you please show us what you've done to fix them?
> You seem to have missed what I said: In order to have *anyone* fix
> them, they need to be acknowledged as DFSG violations. That's what is
> being discussed: whether certain freedoms are or are not DFSG
> violations (and therefore bugs).

"anyone" contains you too...

> Demanding credentials from me personally doesn't seem to be addressing
> the point.

Really? you didn't explain why; what I'm asking is what you did to fix
the bugs you believe to violate your interpretation of DFSG. That's my
point (dunno what you understood)

>> You're discussing docs for a project you're NOT part of
> Does that change whether what I say is true or false?
> As it happens I am a part of the Debian project. But that shouldn't

sure, as an external resource, like many other (and we are very
thankful for that!).

> matter, and I'll ask you to kindly stop attacking people instead of
> arguments.

is this your argumentation?

>> and you're proposing resolutions/suggestions you can NOT even vote
>> for or against; I can't see the point.
> The point is to encourage rational discussion of fact and principle,
> and discourage false arguments, about a resolution to the foundational
> documents of the project. Documents whose promise I very much want
> upheld by all project members, whether they can vote or not.
> If all you're interested in doing is demanding my credentials and
> painting me as an outsider, I don't think this contributes to the
> discussion at all.

It contributes a lot! experience gives new points of view.

Months are passed and the situation is the same: talk with you is like
talking to walls. I'm going back to ignore you again, like many others
do, sorry.

Sandro Tosi (aka morph, Morpheus, matrixhasu)
My website: http://matrixhasu.altervista.org/
Me at Debian: http://wiki.debian.org/SandroTosi

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