Re: I'm not a huge fan of systemd
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On 07/18/2014 02:51 PM, Brian wrote:
> On Fri 18 Jul 2014 at 13:19:21 -0400, The Wanderer wrote:
>> I think (not having done the research to verify this) that the idea
>> is that some - many? - packages need PAM, and depend (perhaps
>> indirectly) on an appropriate package for that, but that package
>> now depends (perhaps indirectly) on libpam-systemd, which depends
>> on 'systemd-sysv | systemd-shim', which results in systemd-sysv
>> getting installed without notice, even though the original package
>> didn't need systemd in the first place.
>> The only ways I can see to break this dependency would be to either
>> pull the needed functionality out of systemd (which apparently is
>> considered hard enough to not be worth doing, at least by the
>> systemd upstream) or reverse the order of that '|' dependency,
>> which I believe has been rejected on the not unreasonable grounds
>> that it would result in not installing systemd even for people who
>> *don't* care about having it. (As well as on the grounds that
>> systemd-shim won't continue to provide the needed functionality for
>> newer systemd versions, unless people update it in ways that
>> haven't happened yet.)
> The objection to 'systemd-shim | systemd-sysv' was on the more
> objective grounds that systemd-sysv provides the *default* init
I see that as the reason why "people who don't care which one they have
won't get systemd" would be considered a problem, not as a separate
grounds of its own.
> It remains to be seen whether systemd-shim is a dead-end.
Apparently it *has* gotten some form of the needed updates, there's just
some packaging snafu resulting in the updated version's being delayed.
With any luck, that should be resolved soon.
Secrecy is the beginning of tyranny.
A government exists to serve its citizens, not to control them.
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