RE: current Redhat user evaluates Debian
You got that right :-)!
Patrick Cheong
Information Systems Assurance
Measat Broadcast Network Systems
E-mail: patrick_cheong@astro.com.my
Visit us at: http://www.astro.com.my
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ethan Pierce [SMTP:oldschool@vermontel.net]
> Sent: Saturday, July 29, 2000 8:25 AM
> To: montefin; John L. Fjellstad
> Cc: debian-user@lists.debian.org
> Subject: Re: current Redhat user evaluates Debian
>
> Incredible :)
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "montefin" <montefin@finux.com>
> To: "John L. Fjellstad" <john-list@fjellstad.org>
> Cc: <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
> Sent: Friday, July 28, 2000 7:17 PM
> Subject: Re: current Redhat user evaluates Debian
>
>
> >
> > "In a galaxy far away, John L. Fjellstad" wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > I'm a current RedHat user (started with Linux on RedHat because
> > > it was available at Fry's), and I'm currently evaluating
> > > Debian for a possible switch.
> > >
> > > Can anyone come up with a list of advantages of using Debian
> > > Linux over Redhat Linux?
> > > I would also love to hear any the weaknesses Debian has compared
> > > RedHat.
> > >
> >
> > John,
> >
> > I've been dual-booting Red Hat and Win98 on a PII 350, since March,
> > 1999. Before that I'd been dividing my computing pretty much equally
> > between MacOS and NT.
> >
> > In January, 2000, I got serious about setting up a network to serve my
> > websites, front-ended by a firewall box that wouldn't quickly become
> > just 'a piece of Swiss cheese' between my LAN and the outside world.
> >
> > In other words, I wanted a system configuration that would impose a
> > strict, consistent, logical hierarchy and be easy to maintain and update
> > against any new security exploits that would inevitably come at it.
> >
> > I looked into Slackware, SuSE, Debian and also OpenBSD and FreeBSD.
> >
> > In March, 2000, I picked up a 1992-era 486DX 66 with a modest 514Mb hard
> > drive, at Goodwill of all places. $120 and all the hardware was Linux
> > compatible!
> >
> > The local LUG (Linux Users Group) here, offered to make free burns of
> > any distros members wanted to try. I got a CD each for Debian, Slack and
> > SuSE.
> >
> > Since I'd already started auditing this (the debian-users) mailing list,
> > I popped in the Debian CD first and found I only had part of what I
> > needed. But it made enough sense that I downloaded a set of tools from
> > http://www.debian.org to floppies and partitioned the 'Goodwill Special'
> > as 100% pure Debian and installed a workable 'Slink' (Debian's current
> > stable release) base system.
> >
> > Over a 56k modem and using 'dselect' (Debian's front-end to 'dpkg', the
> > package management tool), I fleshed out 'Slink', but realized it was
> > pretty outdated as compared to the Red Hat 6.1 conglomeration I was
> > using on the PII.
> >
> > So I ordered a set of CD's for Debian 'Potato' (at the time, Debian's
> > unstable release) from the nice people at Greenbush Technologies
> > http://www.greenbush.com/cgi-greenbush/order/index.cgi .
> >
> > But before the CD's arrived I'd discovered apt-get (Debian's system for
> > upgrading from file, http or ftp sources). I never used the CD's.
> >
> > Once you get the hang of apt-get, you realize there isn't much else out
> > there that you can even compare it with.
> >
> > Almost overnight, online, I went from 'Slink' to 'Potato', without
> > having to bother the great folks on this list too much (I hope). All of
> > a sudden, Red Hat was looking outdated!
> >
> > BTW, if apt-get is my #1 reason for going forward with Debian for my
> > firewall, this list is a close second. I have attempted about nine times
> > to get email support from Red Hat, support I paid for, and never got
> > past a bot or a 'customer service' representative who couldn't
> > understand how I could possibly be feeling frustrated. Never once did
> > anyone who knew anything ever respond.
> >
> > In late June, 2000, I upgraded from the 56k modem to a 192k/192k SDSL
> > connection, installed linux-2.2.16, set up the network, ssh and ssl,
> > then just last night decided to 'apt-get' myself from mostly 'Potato' to
> > full 'Woody' (Debian's current development release).
> >
> > Maybe I've gotten too confident in the Debian development team for
> > 'Woody' on a firewall?
> >
> > If apt-get was great at 56k, it is mind-boggling at 192k. Especially if
> > you've ever tried to get a crucial security update from Red Hat or one
> > of its mirrors and gotten an insipid dialogue saying more or less 'sorry
> > all circuits are busy' or 'that site/directory/file does not exist'.
> >
> > Best of all, once you've done an 'apt-get dist-upgrade', a complete
> > upgrading of everything you have chosen to have on your Debian system --
> > online -- in under an hour -- whenever you want (I do it weekly) -- you
> > never want to go back to anything like the horrors I experienced
> > upgrading from Red Hat 6.0 to 6.1.
> >
> > RH 6.2? No thank you.
> >
> > However, I'm continuing to run Red Hat 6.1 on the PII.
> >
> > Are there advantages to Red Hat over Debian?
> >
> > Well, just the day before yesterday, a brand-new Red Hat user snuck onto
> > this list and asked why Red Hat wasn't recognizing his new ethernet
> > card. I think they do that because they've heard if you want Linux help,
> > ask the debian-user people. Some have even admitted that.
> >
> > Off the list, I attempted to walk him through the various steps I'd had
> > to learn to set up my network 'the way I wanted it'. I began by asking
> > him questions about his routing table, his kernel, etc., so we'd have
> > enough information to 'just do it'.
> >
> > Finally, he wrote back saying "Hey, thanks, but I know nothing about my
> > kernel since Red Hat did it for me, and somebody else told me just go
> > into linuxconf > Basic host information > Adaptor 1, select the right
> > kernel module, and it worked. But I learned a lot from your questions."
> >
> > And you know (slapping my forehead), I knew that! But it was just too
> > simple.
> >
> > Does Debian have weaknesses as compared to Red Hat?
> >
> > For the paradigm I started with, I'd have to say no. But, for people who
> > just want to 'do it'? Yes. Debian takes work, a greater willingness to
> > read the HOWTO's and manpages, and a strong, dedicated support group in
> > close touch with the developers. Luckily, that last 'weakness' is more
> > than overcome by the debian-users mailing list.
> >
> > Will I switch the PII from Red Hat to Debian?
> >
> > Probably. But, I don't feel any pressing need to switch now that Red
> > Hat's security looseness is tucked in behind a Debian mediated firewall.
> > Of course, security is relative. But, I'll feel relatively secure as
> > long as nobody writes back "Don't do Woody on a firewall!"
> >
> > Still, when friends ask me about 'this thing called Linux', I recommend
> > they go out and buy the latest Red Hat boxed CD set; try Linux; and, if
> > they like it and want to get serious, switch to Debian, Slackware or
> > SuSE.
> >
> > Sorry for the story format and not a neat list. Hope it helps.
> >
> > montefin
> >
> >
> > --
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> >
> >
>
>
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