Re: Finnish X11 keymap on iMac?
On Fri, 15 Aug 2003, Frank Murphy wrote:
> > Both console and X are configured to use PC / standard / finnish-latin1,
> > since I have no use for Apple's own mapping.
> ...
> > All USB keyboards I currently have are meant to be Mac keyboards (whatever
> > usbmgr reported upon connection is included in parentheses):
>
> By Mac keyboard, you seem to mean USB keyboard.
No, I mean Mac keyboard, as in keycaps layout.
> The keys of the third-party
> keyboards are in the standard PC position, right?
They are in the Mac position, since they are meant as replacements for the
narrow iMac keyboard by Apple.
> > 1) original narrow iMac keyboard (Alps Electric?M2452 M2452 on usb1:14.0).
> > 2) Macalley (ALCOR macally on usb1:6.0)
> > 3) noname (ALCOR STRONG MAN KBD HUB on usb1:11.0)
> >
> > On the Apple (Alps) keyboard, <> and §½ are correct ...
>
> That's wierd that you have the system configured as PC / standard /
> finnish-latin1, but the keymaps are correct for the Apple key layout. But, if
> the only problem with this keyboard is the meta-key problem you explained
> earlier, the simple xmodmap change below should fix it (without disabling
> deadkeys, of course).
Inverted (smaller/greater/pipe) and (paragraph/one-half/degree), plus wrong
metakeys. In essence, the Option/apple keys are treated as a Windows keys, even
though the physical position is different than on PC.
> > Meanwhile, both the noname and Macalley, being based upon that same Alcor
> > chipset, behave similarly, with two keys being inverted and with some meta
> > keys being at the wrong place.
>
> So this is the same wierd behavior as before: the keyboards have keys in the
> PC position, and the configuration is for PC, but these keys are mapping to
> the Apple position. I wonder if this is a lower level thing.
The console keymaps work exactly as expected, at least using the iMac keyboard.
> What is your keyboard InputDevice in /etc/X11/XF86Config-4?
Section "InputDevice"
Identifier "Generic Keyboard"
Driver "keyboard"
Option "CoreKeyboard"
Option "XkbRules" "xfree86"
Option "XkbModel" "pc105"
Option "XkbLayout" "fi"
EndSection
> I'd be interested to know what the linux scancodes and X keycodes are for
> these keys on i386 Linux. Are you able to try these on a PC? If so, try these
> commands on both:
>
> # from the console, then press the <>| and §½¶ keys
> $ showkey -s
> $ showkey -k
See attached files.
> # Also, in X, press these keys with the keyboard in the xev window
> $ xev
Haven't found any way to paste the output. :(
> > > > > Before, you had said the following:
> > > > > > On a Finnish/Swedish early iMac with the narrow USB keyboard, xev
> > > > > > says:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Control_L,Alt_L,Super_L,space,Multikey.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > What it should be (as far as Mac OS keymaps and console-tools go):
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Control_L,Mode_switch,Alt_L,space,(?).
> > > > >
> > > > > I haven't seen a Finnish keyboard, but I assume that the keys are
> > > > > physically marked with "ctrl", "alt & option", "Apple-logo/command",
> > > > > "space bar", "Multikey". Is this true?
> > > >
> > > > They are: ctrl, alt/option, apple, spacebar, apple.
>
> I realize something else from another keyboard discussion. Mac OS uses Alt to
> allow some characters to be typed, but Windows and X ususally use AltGr.
> Unfortunately, you don't have a right Alt key on the Apple keyboard. As you
> already said, that makes it impossible to have the exact same keymap on your
> i386 and ppc boxes. Would it make sense to remap the left Apple-logo key to
> Mode_Switch instead of Multikey?
The console-data mac-usb-fi keymap uses the Left_alt as Mode_switch and makes
the left Apple key into a Left_alt, which works very well.
> > Indeed. Anyhow, just to clarify, what I'm trying to achieve is to get the
> > exact same (PC) keyboard layout on all my Debian hardware. For obvious
> > reasons, this cannot work using the narrow iMac keyboard, since some
> > keycaps are missing, but both Alcor chipset-based keyboards have, for all
> > intents and purpose, the exact same layout as any PC keyboard, the only
> > difference being the power key.
>
> Again, it's strange that you have X configured as PC, but it's giving you the
> Apple layout.
...and consistantly so, at that. I would have though that the unified Linux
keycodes would have uniformized that.
--
Martin-Éric Racine
http://www.pp.fishpool.fi/~q-funk/
0x9c
0x56 0xd6
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keycode 28 release
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keycode 86 press
keycode 86 release
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keycode 41 press
keycode 41 release
keycode 54 press
keycode 54 press
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keycode 41 release
keycode 54 release
keycode 100 press
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keycode 41 release
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keycode 29 press
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keycode 60 release
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0x9c
0x29
0xa9
0x36
0x36 0x29
0xa9
0xb6
0xe0 0x38
0xe0 0x38 0xe0 0x38 0xe0 0x38 0xe0 0x38 0xe0 0x38 0x29
0xa9 0xe0 0xb8
0x56
0xd6
0x36
0x56
0xd6
0xb6
0xe0 0x38
0xe0 0x38 0xe0 0x38 0x56
0xd6 0xe0 0xb8
keycode 28 release
keycode 41 press
keycode 41 release
keycode 54 press
keycode 54 press
keycode 41 press
keycode 41 release
keycode 54 release
keycode 100 press
keycode 100 press
keycode 41 press
keycode 41 release
keycode 100 release
keycode 86 press
keycode 86 release
keycode 54 press
keycode 54 press
keycode 86 press
keycode 86 release
keycode 54 release
keycode 100 press
keycode 86 press
keycode 86 release
keycode 100 release
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