craig, even documented on their site, the throwing of the baby with the water is throwing the baby with the water.i think that the so proclaimed techniques sucks. maybe it is the best (will not stop here!) but it sucks big time.
also, it comes to me, after 100's of messages, that you don't like water. and some people do like the kids. that's why they seem to you "whinning". and that's why you surely are unnesessary rude to them. edi.