Hello, On Wed, Oct 13, 2010 at 05:34:29PM +0200, Joachim Breitner wrote:
Hi list, especiall Iain, did you see this mail by zack? Am Mittwoch, den 13.10.2010, 17:06 +0200 schrieb Stefano Zacchiroli:[ M-F-T set to -derivatives ] Dear all, I've been invited to attend the forthcoming UDS (Ubuntu Developer Summit) and I'll be able to attend for a few days from October 25 to October 28. I plan to attend the usual session about the relationship among Debian and Ubuntu, a session which is usually attended by DDs which happen to work with Ubuntu or for Canonical. Something very similar happened last time and I've reported about it [1]. As last time, I don't want to present my own views only, but rather views which are representative of project opinions. Therefore I encourage you to let me know of specific topics you want me to mention in that session and/or that you want me to address face to face with people there. I'll report about them once back. This is a good chance to stress that IMO we want to pursue this kind of collaboration with any derivative or distribution which is interested in collaborating with us. Another example of it is Debian participation at next OpenSUSE conference (thanks to Rhonda) and I'll surely welcome other similar examples in the future (hint hint!).
Thanks for forwarding this. I'll actually be at UDS in person, so can attend the session and discuss things with Zack personally. :)
it occured to me that we implement a possible model of cooperation between Debian and Ubuntu: Most work happens on the Debian side, with active contribution by the Ubuntu people (well, Iain :-)), who then actively bring the development here to Ubuntu.
Right, that's pretty much how it is. There are a couple of others who help when there are large transitions to be done* but these are driven by me. The bus factor here is a bit low…
Iain, how satisfied are you with our model of cooperation? Does it work well for you? If so, maybe you could tell zack about it, e.g. how you ensure that Ubuntu benefits of the DHG work and how it workes out, and he could use it as an example for a possible scheme of cooperation?
I think we're working pretty well. I just take most Debian packages unmodified. Generally my opinion is that collaboration works best when Ubuntu and Debian developers work together, *and* when this manifests itself through Ubuntu developers working directly in Debian. It is rare for me to upload a deviating change to Ubuntu, although this has been done (most notably for ghc6 itself in the latest release, although I did try to encourage this change to come from Debian initially). These are hard to track down and, as a potential source of bugs, make the packages harder to maintain. I don't know what users think though. The only piece of feedback I've really had was on this list, and said that our stuff was out of date and unsuitable for developers. I am also active in the Debian CLI/Mono group, and this is very similar to how we work there too, although the Ubuntu-Debian developer balance is Ubuntu-biased there. Cross-distro packaging teams working in Debian seem to be an excellent way for collaboration to prosper. Actually, one thing which I did do for CLI/Mono was to create an Ubuntu packaging team. This team grants upload access to relevant packages to its members. We could do a similar thing for Haskell if there are members of the group who would be interested in directly uploading to Ubuntu. It's just syncs and rebuilds. I have a modified haskell-pkg-graph.py running to track installability. Cheers, Iain * These require sourceful uploads to effect rebuilds, which can be rather time consuming
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