Re: VI reasons (was Re: Base Set: Suggested additions & removals.)
Andreas Jellinghaus wrote:
>
> editor.exe is the only editor that you can count on being there if all else
> fails and it's absence or replacement would be VERY notable to those who
> expect editor.exe
> lets do a ratio of dos/win* users that will install linux,
> and unix users that will install linux. you have lost.
Well, first off, editor.exe isn't there at all on DOS systems (edit for
later versions or edlin for earlier), but let's not get into that...it's
irrelevant right now. It's up to you, I guess, as to what editor to
use. I think it's pointless to argue about it. I just think we can do
better than ae. I don't personally care since I can use sed, cat, or
any other number of methods to fix my system if need be (I keep a static
vi laying around NFS). *I* take precautions like that, so I don't need
stock rescue disks. Therefore, I'm NOT going to argue about this very
hard at all. I just figured I would voice an opinion to second one that
had been expressed before.
> hey, i'm useing linux for a long time, and i expect
> joe to be there.
Then put it there....I don't see why this has become such a difficult
issue.
> vi would fit if we were talking about unix. but this is debian gnu/linux,
> and not unix, and so it's not vi or edlin or emacs : it's joe.
> everyone can use joe. it might be very frustrateing but it's possible.
> i can't use emacs, and my neighbor can't use vi.
> and even i as a 100% vim user rather like to use joe than a cut down vi where
> lots of functionality is missing.
I feel your pain with emacs. I learned it years ago and dropped it
almost as long ago. I just hate hitting key combos to do things. As
for joe, never used it, but would try it. I've tried ae, though, and I
thought it was functional, but non-intuitive on any user level.
> no new linux user is supposed to do that.
> should i go out and find someone who used edlin
> and editor.exe in the last 12+ years ?
> linux isn't a new unix, there is lots of spirit from the windows world.
My point is that more and more Linux systems are being HEAVILY used in
the business world and therefore would normally have an experienced hand
there to repair the systems. Very few Windows users who dual boot to
Linux would even bother trying to rescue their system...they would
simply reinstall (as Mr. Gates has trained them to do when things go
wrong).
> <me too> i'm useing sed or stuff like this - it's better than ae or
> that broken vi (emulation ?). more often i create new files with echo.
Agreed 10000% :-)
> i don't give a peny for experienced system admins.
> we always find our way to repair a system up to the point where we can
> install vim.deb ...
Very true. It's just handier. Like I said before...it's just an
opinion...not me trying to convince you one way or another.
> and newbies who like ae ? i don't know anybody.
> lets give the newbies a real editor, and we unix sysadmins can either use that
> one too, or continue with our sed/echo/*** hacks.
Sounds good to me. Anything's better than ae, IMO.
> why not create a cdrom with a live filesystem and all available editors on it?
> the contrib cdrom is still pretty empty ...
Not a bad idea, but 75% of my personal computers don't have CD-ROMs :-(
I would guess that most people do, so it's still a great idea (I'm not
saying that just because it doesn't suit me that it's not a good idea
that should be pursued). I think we should find a way to provide a
floppy option, though, just in case. I personally use either Zip disks
or a disk image that's loaded into a ramdisk and also mount an NFS
volume for access to some static binaries.
Then again, I'm just cool like that :-P
Hehehe...
Chris
>
> andreas
>
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