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Bug#231083: marked as done (installation-reports: sarge i386 beta2, success but severe glitches)



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and subject line Bug#231083: installation-reports: sarge i386 beta2, success but severe glitches
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>From aleidenf@bigpond.net.au Wed Feb 04 05:18:27 2004
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Subject: installation-reports: sarge i386 beta2, success but severe glitches
From: Andree Leidenfrost <aleidenf@bigpond.net.au>
To: submit@bugs.debian.org
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Package: installation-reports 
Debian-installer-version: beta2, Debian website
uname -a: whateer came with the installer, 2.4.22...
Date: 04 Feb 04, 21:00:00 GMT+11
Method: installed of 100MB CD, rest from mirror.aarnet.edu.au via ftp

Machine: home grown
Processor: AMD Athlon(tm) XP 2400+ stepping 01
Memory: 512MB
Root Device: /dev/hda2
Root Size/partition table: 
/dev/hda1 swap         1GB
/dev/hda2 /          150MB
/dev/hda3 /root      150MB
/dev/hda5 /tmp         1GB
/dev/hda6 /var         1GB
/dev/hda7 /usr         3GB
/dev/hda8 /usr/local   1GB
/dev/hda9 /home       33GB

Output of lspci (from woody):

00:00.0 Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8367 [KT266]
00:01.0 PCI bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8367 [KT266 AGP]
00:06.0 Ethernet controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL-8139 (rev 10)
00:10.0 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. UHCI USB (rev 80)
00:10.1 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. UHCI USB (rev 80)
00:10.2 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. UHCI USB (rev 80)
00:10.3 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc.: Unknown device 3104 (rev 82)
00:11.0 ISA bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc.: Unknown device 3177
00:11.1 IDE interface: VIA Technologies, Inc. Bus Master IDE (rev 06)
00:11.5 Multimedia audio controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. AC97 Audio Controller (rev 50)
01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc: Unknown device 4966 (rev 01)
01:00.1 Display controller: ATI Technologies Inc: Unknown device 496e (rev 01)

Base System Installation Checklist:

Initial boot worked:	[O]
Configure network HW:	[O]
Config network:		[O]
Detect CD:		[O]
Load installer modules:	[O]
Detect hard drives:	[O]
Partition hard drives:	[O]
Create file systems:	[O]
Mount partitions:	[O]
Install base system:	[O]
Install boot loader:	[O]
Reboot:			[O]
[O] = OK, [E] = Error (please elaborate below), [ ] = didn't try it

Comments/Problems:

Having been a Debian user for 9 years, I'm really impressed.

As far as the non-graphical installer goes: I consider it a featue not a bug - 
a graphical installer really only looks better but doesn't give additioanl
functionality or ease of use. And surely, a non-grphical installer is way more
frugal regarding resources - think people in less privileged countries.

I'll try to avoid the old hat stuff like vicious circle for apt or outdated
kernel. The things I consider most severe are makred with '*', the rest is '-'.

At the end are a few remarks regarding testing in general. Although not part
of d-i, I thought I mention them because they had a lage impact on my
installation experience...

Initial install from CD:
- 'Detecting hardware' runs *three* times all in all. Can't we bring that down
  to 1? (Maybe the fact that I don't have a floopy is responsible.)
- name server should default to gateway rather than being blank IMHO (if no DHCP)
- the hostname is being asked for twice, not good
- domain not asked for, not good
* there is no feedback during filesystem and mountpoint creation, not good
  ('Creating filesystems and mount points - please, stand by' would suffice)
* there is no possibility to do a badblock scan of the HDD, not good
- 'Installing base system' stops at 75% and finishes, cosmetic but irritating
- 'Installing extra packages' stops at 66% and finishes, cosmetic but irritating
  (less than above because quicker)
- install does not try/offer to setup Australian Telstra Bigpond cable modem via
  bpalogin (yeah, might only be me but than again not...)

After reboot:
* I get a message saying: Invalid hostname "aurich3" and some blurb - aurich3 is
  definitely a perfectly valid hostname!
- hotplug is not part of CD - I'm surprised, there's is probablt a reason, though
* lilo config should default to offering choice so that people can specifiy things
  like 'single'

After installation:
* the X windows packages are terribly outdated - there is no excuse for this!
* configuration of xserver-xfree86 should really offer 1280x1024@60 (because
  that's what I use ;-) and so do many others - better 17" TFT)
* X windows is still not working for me, I finally get a graphical screen, the
  mouse is working, *the keyboboard isn't* and I can't even boot into single mode
  to examine the situation - cf. above regarding lilo setup (yeah, I can boot the
  Installation CD in rescue mode I suppose) My system is more than a year old!
- why is gdm not part of the gnome package (I have selected gnome in dselect)?
- time is messed up
- many outdated packages: postfix 2.0.16, mozilla 1.5, xsane 0.91, X,...
- Question: Do you want set up mandb setuid man? Explanation: nothing <doh>
- had to speciify the paper size twice
and so forth...

Bottom line: Debian is truely great (tried RedHat, Mandrake, Suse) - but still
only for the initiated - not read for the average desktop user :-(
-- 
Andree Leidenfrost
Sydney - Australia


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Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 16:49:31 +0100
From: Christian Perrier <bubulle@debian.org>
To: Andree Leidenfrost <aleidenf@bigpond.net.au>, 231083-done@bugs.debian.org
Cc: control@bugs.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#231083: installation-reports: sarge i386 beta2, success but severe glitches
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clone 231083 -1 -2 -3 -4 -5 -6
reassign -1 ddetect
retitle -1 Should not run several times during the installation process
severity -1 minor
reassign -2 netcfg
retitle -2 Domain name server address should default to gateway address
severity -2 wishlist
reassign -3 netcfg
retitle -3 Should ask for a domain name
severity -3 normal
reassign -4 debian-installer
retitle -4 Bad Block scan module needed
severity -4 wishlist
reassign -5 base-installer
retitle -5 Progress bar stops at 75% then waits for a while then finishes
severity -5 minor
reassign -6 hotplug
retitle -6 Hotplug should be installed by default at least with the "Desktop" or "Laptop" tasks
severity -6 wishlist

This is the analysis of your installation report.

This report leads to several individual bug reports for d-i modules.

I won't analyse testing-related remarks. These are well-known testing drawbacks.

> Initial install from CD:
> - 'Detecting hardware' runs *three* times all in all. Can't we bring that down
>   to 1? (Maybe the fact that I don't have a floopy is responsible.)

I'm not really sure the modular design of d-i isn't involved
there. The hardware detection step does not detect the same stuff in
all these steps.

If that's true, then the dialog should be changed to "Detecting needed
hardware"....

I assign this to ddetect (-1 bug above).


> - name server should default to gateway rather than being blank IMHO (if no DHCP)

Give that most user use to hit Enter too quickly there, I'm definitely
not in favor of this change.

But let's record this as a wishlist against netcfg


> - the hostname is being asked for twice, not good

Known bug. Fixed (#227897)

> - domain not asked for, not good

Well, you're right about that. resolv.conf should be then written, probably.


> * there is no feedback during filesystem and mountpoint creation, not good
>   ('Creating filesystems and mount points - please, stand by' would suffice)

You're right about current partitioner module. However, the future
partitioning tool (partman) has this feature, as well as the
autopartitioning module. If you're OK, I don't
record this as a bug.


> * there is no possibility to do a badblock scan of the HDD, not good

Sure, None of the partitioning tools offer this option.

The best would be a dedicated module, just for avoiding implementing
this in several modules.

I assign this to debian-installer as a wishlist for a new module

> - 'Installing base system' stops at 75% and finishes, cosmetic but irritating

This bug belongs to the base-installer package, imho

> - 'Installing extra packages' stops at 66% and finishes, cosmetic but irritating
>   (less than above because quicker)

Probably the same.


> - install does not try/offer to setup Australian Telstra Bigpond cable modem via
>   bpalogin (yeah, might only be me but than again not...)


Well, this looks like a pretty specialized demand....Dunno if
recording a bug will trigger something.

> 
> After reboot:
> * I get a message saying: Invalid hostname "aurich3" and some blurb - aurich3 is
>   definitely a perfectly valid hostname!

No idea where this comes from


> - hotplug is not part of CD - I'm surprised, there's is probablt a reason, though


I think you mean it should be installed *by default* on any Debian
system.

Opinions may differ about this. However, having hotplug installed as
part of the "Desktop" tasks could be interesting as Desktop
Workstations are probably the real target for this package.

I assign this a a wishlist bug against the hotplug package. I guess
that hotplus package maintainer will have a more precise idea of what
to do....

> * lilo config should default to offering choice so that people can specifiy things
>   like 'single'

This is #229211, extended.

> 
> After installation:

As I said, these are well-known "testing is outdated" issues....

> 
> Bottom line: Debian is truely great (tried RedHat, Mandrake, Suse) - but still
> only for the initiated - not read for the average desktop user :-(

Hmmm, I beg to disagree a bit there. See #228553, for instance....





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