Re: Sun Java available from non-free
On Jun 08, 2006 at 12:19, MJ Ray praised the llamas by saying:
> Wouter Verhelst <wouter@debian.org>
> > On Wed, Jun 07, 2006 at 05:42:27PM +0100, MJ Ray wrote:
> > > Exactly! It's not our fault, so why should we indemnify Sun against it?
> >
> > If it's not our fault, it's not under our control, and we *don't* need
> > to indemnify. That's what the FAQ says; and whether or not it has legal
> > value, it *does* explain the interpretation Sun gives to its license.
>
> Changes to debian are made under debian's control (in theory).
>
> The reason I raised the indemnity in particular is that the FAQ
> does not contradict this concern, so all the "should we ignore
> the FAQ" debate didn't affect it.
>
> Quoth the FAQ:
> | Simply put, Sun requires indemnification to limit its exposure for
> | issues that are not Sun's fault. If your conduct or your OS causes
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> | a problem that results in a third-party claim, then Sun expects you
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> | to take responsibility for it. Note that you are not indemnifying
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> | Sun against claims that are a result of something in Sun's code. You
> | also are not indemnifying Sun against claims due to changes that a
> | downstream distributor has made to your OS.
>
> You *are* indemnifying Sun against claims due to changes to your
> OS whose inclusion you control. It's only downstream changes
> that are excluded, not upstream. (AIUI, Gentoo can avoid this
> neatly, with its users' install commands rebuilding the OS.)
Out of interest, if[0] that is saying that "we agree that anything isn't
Sun's fault isn't Sun's fault" (which is fair enough) then that doesn't
mention anything about any warranty that we might offer. For the large
majority of the software we ship, we disclaim any warranty what so ever.
Can we not just disclaim all warranty on Sun's java like we do with the
rest of our software, or is there something in the license that forces
us to give a warranty?
[0] I'm going by MJ's comments. I haven't had chance to check the actual
license, so take this as a curious question from someone interested to
know the answer.
>
> Do you agree, or what have I missed?
>
> Regards,
--
David Pashley
david@davidpashley.com
Nihil curo de ista tua stulta superstitione.
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